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Japanese Class A 1/16

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  • #16
    Hi Manfred

    Thanks again for the new posting. Question, could you post a still picture of the gear box as close and clear as you can? That way I can enlarge the picture to better see your working mechanism. From the video it is a little hard to see the setup. Also where did you buy your gears from? It is hard to find them here in Canada.
    George
    Last edited by george; 03-15-2015, 07:27 PM.

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    • #17
      Here is a contra-rotating out runner. Its about 16mm dia at the mounts. Click image for larger version

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      Before finding this I tried this:Click image for larger version

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ID:	97709 Both of these worked but were difficult to keep aligned. The larger one took up too much space.

      So I tried this:Click image for larger version

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ID:	97710 It worked but it was fiddly to keep aligned and, again, it took up too much space.

      So I made this from some old servo gears:Click image for larger version

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ID:	97711Click image for larger version

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ID:	97712 Much better performance and smoother running, so I incorporated it into the servo / receiver tray and ended up with this:Click image for larger version

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ID:	97713 Its quiet, strong and it fits in a 1/72 scale Type A.

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      • #18
        I also tried this Click image for larger version

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ID:	97714 as a refinement of the crown and pinion wheels and again, it worked but it was no where near as smooth as the final gearbox that used old nylon servo gears.

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        • #19
          There seems to be quite a few solutions to the contra counter egg beater enigma. With this many people workig on a design, it should produce several ideas that work. At this point, it looks lke everyone's rig has to be fine tuned, for various reasons. Sort of like a defense dept contract and all the contractors are scrambling to get a proto up for bidding. One thing I notice, is the metal gears are nice looking, but have such a tighter tollerance, are subject to water compression, and are noisey. The plastic gears, not so much. Price would be another factor. Corrosion, in my case, is a big issue. copper and brass end up looking like the Statue of Liberty in less than a week. That green funk builds up quick. I dont want to have to take the gears out once a week to polish, like I have to do with the cymbals on my drum kit. So I'm taking the day off working on the type IX, and jummping into my old gearbox, and rummage around the junk bin for usable parts.Click image for larger version

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ID:	97715Its a start. 4 gears one bicycle spoke, one telescoping portable radio antenna, now a cup of coffee, and find a magic wand.
          Last edited by Von Hilde; 03-16-2015, 07:05 AM.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by He Who Shall Not Be Named View Post
            Good catch, Romel. I'll see if I can punch out a 555's motor-shaft. Film at eleven!

            M
            Any luck so far?

            Was expecting you'll go with building your own contrarotating gearbox.

            BTW, with the tandem motors vs single motor with contrarotating gearbox, which would be more electrical power hungry?
            Make it simple, make strong, make it work!

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by HardRock View Post
              I also tried this [ATTACH=CONFIG]30426[/ATTACH] as a refinement of the crown and pinion wheels and again, it worked but it was no where near as smooth as the final gearbox that used old nylon servo gears.
              Good stuff, HardRock. Tell me more about the outrunner. How do you get two counter-rotating outputs from the thing. Most interested in this.

              M
              "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Von Hilde View Post
                There seems to be quite a few solutions to the contra counter egg beater enigma. With this many people workig on a design, it should produce several ideas that work. At this point, it looks lke everyone's rig has to be fine tuned, for various reasons. Sort of like a defense dept contract and all the contractors are scrambling to get a proto up for bidding. One thing I notice, is the metal gears are nice looking, but have such a tighter tollerance, are subject to water compression, and are noisey. The plastic gears, not so much. Price would be another factor. Corrosion, in my case, is a big issue. copper and brass end up looking like the Statue of Liberty in less than a week. That green funk builds up quick. I dont want to have to take the gears out once a week to polish, like I have to do with the cymbals on my drum kit. So I'm taking the day off working on the type IX, and jummping into my old gearbox, and rummage around the junk bin for usable parts.[ATTACH=CONFIG]30427[/ATTACH]Its a start. 4 gears one bicycle spoke, one telescoping portable radio antenna, now a cup of coffee, and find a magic wand.
                I love this McGuiver. A used thum tac, a small bottle of nitro glycerine, a copy of the girl guides field manual, one used condom and a hamster. Yep, we're ready!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by He Who Shall Not Be Named View Post
                  Good stuff, HardRock. Tell me more about the outrunner. How do you get two counter-rotating outputs from the thing. Most interested in this.

                  M
                  The central (black) mounting ring has three lugs that carry three spacing rods to mount on the silver bracket at the left of the photograph. Just read this back and even I don't understand it. Here's a photograph.Click image for larger version

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ID:	97716 or two Click image for larger version

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ID:	97717 Click image for larger version

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ID:	97718 The front out runner is directly connected to the large (black) forward spindle and the rear out runner drives the central (silver) spindle. It needs two ESCs to run and provides quite a serious amount of contra-rotating power.

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                  • #24
                    Click image for larger version

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ID:	97719After a few hours of consultation, His Royal Higness, Tigger the cat said,"Why stick a square box in a round hull?" Only one trunion, will go on a pin thru the side of the case. Teflon shims will adjust the slop in the playClick image for larger version

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ID:	97720Ok, two trunions, and now an end cover to keep the input shaft in line and its on to some propeller issues for a drill motor test, then I can scramble some eggs in a bowl.Click image for larger version

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ID:	97721Click image for larger version

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ID:	97722Click image for larger version

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                    Last edited by Von Hilde; 03-16-2015, 12:37 PM.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Von Hilde View Post
                      [ATTACH=CONFIG]30431[/ATTACH]After a few hours of consultation, His Royal Higness, Tigger the cat said,"Why stick a square box in a round hull?" Only one trunion, will go on a pin thru the side of the case. Teflon shims will adjust the slop in the play
                      ... because you want to ballance the lateral pressure presented by the bevel-gear. Use two, not one.

                      M
                      "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

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                      • #26
                        The Cat fell asleep from boredom, or he would have told me that

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Von Hilde View Post
                          The Cat fell asleep from boredom, or he would have told me that
                          (in the urgent voice of William Shatner) "cat... must.... be.... destroyed!"
                          "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

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                          • #28
                            Tea and scones guys?
                            Fertig zum unterwasser.

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                            • #29
                              Prototype works fine,just stuck some Revell plastic props to see it work.Click image for larger version

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by redboat219 View Post
                                Any luck so far?

                                Was expecting you'll go with building your own contrarotating gearbox.

                                BTW, with the tandem motors vs single motor with contrarotating gearbox, which would be more electrical power hungry?
                                I think the Doctor M, will be tied up with his and Mike's new toys for a while, but as far as power draw goes, It would depend on the size of the particular motor or motors amperage draw. I would say most models are way overpowered to begin with, so stepping down to two small motors can be better than one big one that has to overcome the friction drag in power, caused by the gear box. The loose tollerance of the gears to allow the compressed water passage is a bigger deal than suspected. My prototype box gets hot after a minuite or so running on the drill power during tests, and thats with the plastic gears. Thats why its a prototype. The next one will have bearings, instead of bushings thruout the drive line. The Idea of two small motors, side by side with the drive line in between might be the most efficent all around.

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