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Salt Water Communications

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  • Salt Water Communications

    I live in San Diego and fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you see it) I am surrounded by salt water. This includes our local RC pond. I just received the Kilo kit from Bob Martin (thank you very much Bob) and wanted to explore ways to communicate in salt water. I came upon this research paper that describes how they developed an acoustic system for RC vehicles that is simple and intuitive using acoustics. IT looks like the form factor could be implemented in RC Submarines and I wanted to get the opinions from the experts on here. In the meantime I plan to run the antenna up through the a snorkel so I can run at periscope depth in the local pond. I have about six months left in my Middle East deployment so have time to work out the problem set :)

    Here is the link to the paper
    http://robert.katzschmann.eu/wp-cont...015compact.pdf

    Thoughts?
    Cory

  • #2
    Originally posted by coryhenry View Post
    I live in San Diego and fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you see it) I am surrounded by salt water. This includes our local RC pond. I just received the Kilo kit from Bob Martin (thank you very much Bob) and wanted to explore ways to communicate in salt water. I came upon this research paper that describes how they developed an acoustic system for RC vehicles that is simple and intuitive using acoustics. IT looks like the form factor could be implemented in RC Submarines and I wanted to get the opinions from the experts on here. In the meantime I plan to run the antenna up through the a snorkel so I can run at periscope depth in the local pond. I have about six months left in my Middle East deployment so have time to work out the problem set :)

    Here is the link to the paper
    http://robert.katzschmann.eu/wp-cont...015compact.pdf

    Thoughts?
    Cory
    Hi Cory,

    Very interesting concept for sure! But it's way above my pay grade, but I am sure there will be some intelligent responses to your question!

    Cory! Thank you for your service, and stay safe over there!

    Rob

    "Firemen can stand the heat"

    Comment


    • #3
      That's an interesting solution. What I didn't get from the paper is how exactly they're controlling the submarine... I.E., does the receiver output standard pulses for servo control, or did they do something else? There are standard library functions for Raspberry PI that allow direct control of servos using a PI board, and that board could receive commands from this system. The other thing that would need to be solved, if this evern turned into a hobby system, is how to run multiple systems without interferenece...
      "It does not take so many words to speak the truth" Chief Joseph

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by coryhenry View Post
        I live in San Diego and fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you see it) I am surrounded by salt water. This includes our local RC pond. I just received the Kilo kit from Bob Martin (thank you very much Bob) and wanted to explore ways to communicate in salt water. I came upon this research paper that describes how they developed an acoustic system for RC vehicles that is simple and intuitive using acoustics. IT looks like the form factor could be implemented in RC Submarines and I wanted to get the opinions from the experts on here. In the meantime I plan to run the antenna up through the a snorkel so I can run at periscope depth in the local pond. I have about six months left in my Middle East deployment so have time to work out the problem set :)

        Here is the link to the paper
        http://robert.katzschmann.eu/wp-cont...015compact.pdf

        Thoughts?
        Cory
        Cory,
        ‘I would like to welcome you to join us when we gather at Yorba Linda regional park. Mike Dory, a early trail blazer in our hobby, lives in your area and drives up with his Type 7. He used to run in the brackish ponds around SanDiego, but you needed to keep a antenna above the surface, much like those that use 2.4 GHz today. If you are interested, pm me with your email and I will forward it to the crew at SuRon LA.
        peace,
        tom
        If you can cut, drill, saw, hit things and swear a lot, you're well on the way to building a working model sub.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by coryhenry View Post
          I live in San Diego and fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you see it) I am surrounded by salt water. This includes our local RC pond. I just received the Kilo kit from Bob Martin (thank you very much Bob) and wanted to explore ways to communicate in salt water. I came upon this research paper that describes how they developed an acoustic system for RC vehicles that is simple and intuitive using acoustics. IT looks like the form factor could be implemented in RC Submarines and I wanted to get the opinions from the experts on here. In the meantime I plan to run the antenna up through the a snorkel so I can run at periscope depth in the local pond. I have about six months left in my Middle East deployment so have time to work out the problem set :)

          Here is the link to the paper
          http://robert.katzschmann.eu/wp-cont...015compact.pdf

          Thoughts?
          Cory
          2.4GHz for the RC Submariner….the next step.
          v/r "Sub" Ed

          Silent Service "Cold War" Veteran (The good years!)
          NEVER underestimate the power of a Sailor who served aboard a submarine.
          USS ULYSSES S GRANT-USS SHARK-USS NAUTILUS-USS KEY WEST-USS BLUEBACK-USS PATRICK HENRY-K432-U25-SSRN SEAVIEW-PROTEUS-NAUTILUS

          Comment


          • #6
            Thanks everyone for the suggestions and articles. Unfortunately the suggestions don't solve the root problem of being able to communicate underwater in salt water. Any other ideas?

            Comment


            • #7
              How about lasers? Maybe design a control system similar to those infrared controllers for toy RC helicopters. As IR is blocked by water we need swap out the IR diode with a laser (green).
              Make it simple, make strong, make it work!

              Comment


              • #8
                I did see some research with laser comms. They do require a sophisticated tracking and aiming mechanism to ensure the transmitter and receiver are always in alignment. The IR systems have a very wide beam so don't really have that problem.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Electronics are beyond me but how about a system that uses acoustics? Going back to the IR remote, how about swapping a piezoelectric transducer to the IR diode to send out "pings" which corresponds to control commands. An piezoelectric receiver on the boat listens for the pings
                  Last edited by redboat219; 07-15-2020, 03:36 AM.
                  Make it simple, make strong, make it work!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Not sure if this could be done but what if you made a repeater radio that could plug in your radio receiver then translates the received signal and sends it out as 75 hz. You could then buy the latest greatest radio and plug its receiver in the repeater radio. While you are at it add WIFI so you could send commands from a phone. Phones don't show up well in sunshine though.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      This is the architecture I was thinking could work.
                      Click image for larger version

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                      • #12
                        You could eliminate the radio and just hook a handheld game controller directly to the arduino.
                        Make it simple, make strong, make it work!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by redboat219 View Post
                          You could eliminate the radio and just hook a handheld game controller directly to the arduino.
                          You are absolutely correct, I just wanted to make a package that could be used with any system and keep it comfortable for the normal RC user, not always a gamer :)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Check out this robot fish https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...=1594983359058
                            Make it simple, make strong, make it work!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              How freaking cool is that! Its not a far stretch of the imagination to see the controls interfaced with an above surface link. And secondary-the hydraulic propulsion is way cool (good for Sci-fi and future sub models)

                              Comment

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