Recent uboat pictures

[greenman407]

[greenman407]

[Von Hilde]

There appears to be a discrepency with the last few pictures of U18. The cammo boat has no RDF visible, possibly because it was mounted portside tower bulkhead, and was retractable, in later model type IIAs and Bs. It also has limber holes along the gunnels, amidships, above the pressure hull. The other pics of it there are no lateral holes. The picture of the WOs scanning the horizon the tower has some sort of watertite apparatus mounted just forward of the starbord running lite housing and a 2cm flak mount on the tower. Ive seen a color pic of the Type II A with that cammo, Shades of blue-grey which was a Medeterranian paint job. The pictures of the U13 and the others were taken when Hitler visited the Flotilla. He stopped at U7 that day which was one of the boats lined up for inspection. I have some of the pics from that inspection somewhere, but trying to find where I put them is a delima. I had them for the detail close ups of the boat that Im building.

[Warpatroller]

I think the discrepancy is just modifications made to the boat over time. The photo with the 18 on the side of the tower is a much earlier photo of the same boat (some time between 1935 and 1938). By 1943, it had been partially disassembled, transported to the Black Sea and reassembled. It was then sporting cammo banding on the tower, carrying a red star emblem (with the torpedo bursting through it), had additional flood holes and the 20mm AA gun added.

The U18 was a IIB. I thought all U-Boats had retractable RDF loop antennas, but I could be wrong.

[Von Hilde]

the RDFs all retracted but in different places. Check out U 10 next to 18 and 13 and the boat behind it> their antenna are mounted forward on the step of the tower. The ones that were inside the tower were recessed into the bulkhead. Heres a picture of U 23 (left)on its side on a barge on the way to Istanbul. Note the limberholes wernt changed as is the boat on the right either. The pic of the boat with the Black Sea cammo up top is mis captioned as 18. It is U23, Note no aft flak Here is U 9, one of the Black Sea boats with the antenna forward. as opposed to the recessed in tower on another type II Of the 6 boats that went, 9, 18 and 24 the Russians raised off of Romania and were re sunk by target pratcise in 46. 19, 20 and 23 are still preserved on the bottom of the Northern Turkish coast. U 18 U19 and 20 had 2cm zwiling. Twin mounts added after Istambul. U 23 was a single mountU 19 Istanbul, notice the twin barrels behind the seaman at parade rest on the wintergarden aft.

[Von Hilde]

After looking closer at the picture of the lookouts on the bridge, I notice the gun mount is a post 43 with the off set shoulder pads. This mount was designed for twin 2cm flak. This mount has only one gun on the gunners left. its mounted perpindicular so the magazine extends on his left side. Normally the right side gun is mounted sideways to facilitate the magazine on top. This was so the gunner could replace magazines with the left hand while the right hand pulled the trigger lever on the handlebar. I also see that there is a magazine ready box attachment on the transverse counter weight. Griffon models make a real accurate 1/72scale photo etched brass set fot the Zwieling mounts, with the early and late bases for the u boats and shnellboat. A real P.I.A. to put together but look real nice when done. A nice scratch built mod to put on a special Navy type IIA tower. Or better yet go big and do a sheerline.

[Von Hilde]

Mr Warpatroler, you are correct about the adding of the limber holes on 18. here she is on the barge on her side along with u20. I wonder why they opened the keels. Perhaps more lead balast to compinsate for the added weight above the waterline. I was noticing the different cone style forward gun mounts in lieu of the old drum shaped on some of the Black Sea boats as well. Heres a shot of the torpedo busting the red star emblem you spoke of

[greenman407]

[greenman407]

[Von Hilde]

Ahh! some good rare detail shots. U 25 was a type I. The overall design looked like it would have been a good boat, but the operational faults overcame its looks. Ive gone ahead and decided to turn my 1/24 type II into a Mere Noir after seeing all thes pics of the 2s. I got the dremmel saw out and have done some chopping on the tower for the wintergarden. According to the u boat dkm archives, all the type IIs that were operationally deployed after 43, except the training boats, were equipped with the extra twin 20cm flak mounts fore and aft. However most got the twin mounts but only, a few had two guns on each station. The IIDs replaced the forward Flak mount with a 195mm deck gun and had twin 20s in the wintergarden. Not many pics of the IIs after 44 as most were lost after May 43. I have contacted Mr Kolay of the Turkish Meritime Museum, and he is going to send me some pictures that the museum has of the German boats they had. Perhaps some my be ones that havent been published as of yet. Apparently quite a few modifications were made in Istanbul when the boats got there before they deployed in the Black Sea. It would be wonderful if they have some pictures of the construction stuck away somewhere

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

You guys are posting great photos, and the narrative is most informative. You've taken me back to school. Keep it up, please.

M

[greenman407]

[reddevil]

Don't miss Uncle Karl's face when trying to jump up the gangway. Gangway's position on tower's handrail seems quite unsafe and doesn't have its own handrails mounted either.

[Von Hilde]

Reddevil, of course its dangerous and unsafe, the U Boats themselves were "dangerous and unsafe" Not to worry about Uncle Carl, He got his sea leggs 20 years before. Actually it was standard procedure to lay the gangplank on the top of the railings when transferring from a larger ship with higher gunnels or some of the high seawalls in the larger ports. Thats a fancy plank compaired to some of the 35cm wide boards they sometimes used. He does look a bit concerned or focused. Might be timing his step with the up and down of the boat. The other guy, is most likely Heinrich Lieb, the captain, looks like he tripped or is ducking under the wire, in a hurry to get around the gun and help steady the plank. That was his last patrol when he got the Knights Cross with Oak Leaves presented by Carl that day for sinking 8 ships, 47,279 tons off of Africa on that patrol. The picture of U31 on its side has a good view of the unique deck layout on the type VIIA. It appears the extended perriscope has been bent. U31 was the first boat to attack the first convoy OB-Y Sept 39. It was sunk in Jadebusen by RAF bombers on March 11 1940 with all hands (58) lost. It was raised later that month and put back in service(possibly that picture is after raising) It was sunk again north of Ireland by RAF in Nov 40 2 dead 44 survivors.

[Von Hilde]

The picture of the forward tower mounted twin 2cm flak indicates that its from U 33. It is not. The U 33 was a type VIIA that was sunk in Feb 40. The VIIA towers were completely different than the VIIB and C. The Cs and Bs had the helmsmans port hole in the controll room as in the picture. The A models had a different placement of the perriscopes. No port hole below the lower splash shield. The magnetic compass housings, The little "dog house" in front of the tower, were different as well. The As were wider and lower than the Bs and Cs. The twin mount C-30 in the LC-30/37mount flak were not introduced until summer of 43. U33 only completed 3 patrols. Heres another, rare color view of 33on her last patrol with no flak fwd and single mount aft. Note: No lower splash shield either