Hybrid Ballast Tank/Piston System

[rwtdiver]

There is no crying in baseball... there is no GPS in submarines. Rob- Maybe I misunderstood the above post-but I believe GPS signals won't penetrate water. That was basically controlled using Gyros (more like INS from the not too old days of flying)

Hi Bob,

I here what you are saying! And you are correct! I think what I trying to relate to was, Nick use of electronics to achieve auto leveling in his sub was to a certain extent similar to GPS in quadcopter or VTOL flight system to hold the aircraft in a stable attitude! I realize they are two different types of systems.

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[Bob Gato]

There is no crying in baseball... there is no GPS in submarines. Rob- Maybe I misunderstood the above post-but I believe GPS signals won't penetrate water. That was basically controlled using Gyros (more like INS from the not too old days of flying)

[rwtdiver]

Nick,

Please keep it coming! Before I got into submarines, I was totally involved with GPS system in my VTOL aircraft!



Having to monitor stability along with vertical and horizontal flight system made it impossible without GPS system! I am still really new at sub driver ballast system set ups, but with each new sub I build I am getting better! But I would really like to have a set up as nice as yours! Please keep it coming! The video was very good! It really showed how the GPS system was working to keep the boat level! Great stuff!!!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[Monahan Steam Models]

Okay thanks guys. I’ll keep the updates coming then.

Topics like these can start out interesting but can quickly become a storage space waste on the servers if the content isn’t useful to the group.

It will be interesting to see how this dumb thing works in the water once it is finally at that point. I have to say this project has been seriously kicking me in my backside trying to develop it as best I can.

The next boat build after this project will be a Bronco type XXIII and use by far one of my favorite ballast systems, which is David’s Snort design. That project will be using a standard 2 1/2” MSD I got from Bob a while back.

Nick

[trout]

Ditto what Bob said. Nick, you are pushing the boundaries and I am just learning from you.

[RCSubGuy]

Nick,


Oh, hell no. DO NOT STOP. I think what you're doing is simply so far beyond the realm of we mortals that all we can do is sit back in awe and hope that the end product will somehow allow us to understand how all this work will actually function in a working cylinder.

This is amazing stuff. Please continue!

Bob

[Monahan Steam Models]

Another milestone achieved today with the development of the program code that operates the system. Yesterday I took a short and poorly done video explaining the manual operation of the piston trim tanks and attempted to explain the setting up of the recorded submerged and surfaced trimmed set points for piston trim tanks Using the record function.

In the video I mentioned recording the distance of each trim piston’s distance from the sensor in either submerged or surfaced trim mode. Today, with the help of my lovely wife, we were able to complete the part of the program that takes the previously recorded trim tank distances and apply them to the automatic surface or submerge routines.

Once we had the trim tanks reliably and repeatability moving to their recorded distances in auto mode, the next step was bringing the main central ballast tank functions into the automatic ballast routine program.

Very quickly we were able to get the timing and logic of controlling the main ballast tank’s surfaced and submerged conditions worked into the trim tanks program logic.

The last step in completing the program is adding a variable percentage delay to the forward trim tanks movement before the stern trim tank starts to move. This is to allow a bow up or bow down pitch when surfacing or submerging statically.

Once the program is finished I can start moving on to actually testing the WTC in the tank and adjustIng the gyro pitch PID values.

This system is a different way of doing things from what has been done to date. I get it if you don’t like it or agree with it. I’m just exploring the what else. The boat launches both gas and electric torpedoes which have their own effects on trimming. This alone sets up the need for a variable set trim state in both submerged and surfaced settlings.

If the work I keep posting is not of interest to the the group I will gladly stop sharing.

nick

[Monahan Steam Models]

I am watching boring routine, simple ho-hum ...from the future. This is how ALL model subs will operate maybe 8-10 years from now...so us ''kiddies'' should sit and pay attention!! "Pure Magic"

Thanks Nick!-BG

Thanks BG.

Here is a quick and badly done more informative video update on how the system works as of today. Sorry, I hate having to talk on camera.

https://youtu.be/ndDZtuh0jGQ

Nick

[Bob Gato]

I am watching boring routine, simple ho-hum ...from the future. This is how ALL model subs will operate maybe 8-10 years from now...so us ''kiddies'' should sit and pay attention!! "Pure Magic"

Thanks Nick!-BG

[Monahan Steam Models]

You are not forgotten! In fact, I look forward to your posts. You are an innovator and wonderfully creative.

Thanks Tom!

I’m just grumbling really. Feel that I’ve been staring at the computer screen for far too many hours, for far too many days working through writing each block of code for this dang project. I’d rather be using the time building something. But I dug this hole so I’m going to see it through.

Good news though. I’ve finally uploaded the latest code to the hybrid WTC project that includes the auto leveling trim features using the gyro data. Here’s a quick and dirty video I just took with the gyro removed from the rear upper equipment shelf. The gyro is mounted on a breadboard while the forward and rear equipment racks and pistons are placed side by side on the bench. During the video I make pitch adjustments to the breadboard which the effects are shown in each of the piston’s travel when filling or emptying. Normally the input and effects are smoother when everything is assembled because of the direct feedback to the gyro.

https://youtu.be/pfLRpzbLxK4

The auto leveling function is currently only active and used for setting up the initial static dived trim and the initial static surfaced trim. The pitch can be overridden from 0 degrees (or even keel) to 1 degree increments up to + 30 degree up bow pitch or to - 30 degrees down bow pitch. Each of these trimmed states are then recorded and the data is then applied to a selectable function on the transmitter named ballast routine. Ballast routine when selected is a automatic dive or surface routine when used. Meaning it takes the boat down to the depth and pitch previously recorded in the dived state or brings the boat back to the surfaced trim and pitch previously recorded in the surfaced state. These automatic functions are accomplished by moving the pistons to the recorded distances away from the laser sensors taken during the initial dived and surfaced trimming. Hope all this junk makes sense. I may need to ask one of you how the hell this thing works!

Nick

[trout]

You are not forgotten! In fact, I look forward to your posts. You are an innovator and wonderfully creative.

[Monahan Steam Models]

While progress is being made and posted at each of the far edges of this forum, I am still in the trenches of writing the code that will get this hybrid ballast test platform up and running. So far the unit is completely controllable from the manual transmitter inputs.

Working out the auto sensor based inputs now. Like dive on a 0 degree keel or minus or plus degree keel stetting. This sets up basic trimming function base lines. Is the boat loaded or unloaded? Sets up the boats attitude at each condition. It’s a deep hole of despair, but one I hope to conquer soon.

[Monahan Steam Models]

You are "out of control", my friend-but your robot is not! Very impressive!

Thanks Bud!

I can’t take all the credit though. The robot is a kit made for experimenting and learning. I just made a number of small modifications to the Arduino code it uses to make it a bit more stable.

[Bob Gato]

You are "out of control", my friend-but your robot is not! Very impressive!

[Monahan Steam Models]

Been burning the candle at both ends working on this ww2 type VIIC project. First was the electric torpedoes and the months of daily r&d that went into testing various designs. Then was Development of the launch mechanism design that could with one channel open launch and close the doors of all five tubes. (Still need to work on the aft tube). Then it was the development of the gas Torpedoes and the work to get them to load and launch with the launch tubes. Lately the work was focused on the hybrid WTC and even more recently the code development that operates all the gizmos. Lots of testing again of different sensors and code structures.

I’m fried. Brain is mush. Decided to take a break away from the sub building and build a 2 wheeled self balancing autonomous robot for my 2 yr old daughter who absolutely loves the Pixar film Wally. Some custom code was written for it but here it is. It uses echo location to avoid obstacles (mostly). Not perfect but I’m beat. Same principal as a self leveling sub.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_YL9QggYgwo&feature=youtu.be