A Moebius Skipjack from the land of OZ...

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

work'n on it. Enjoy your winter!

M

[Slats]

Myron's point about too many holes in the SAS system is valid, and a source of concern for the operator of a model submarine employing this type ballast sub-system. However, the inclusion of the safety float-valve in the plumbing of the Caswell-Merriman SAS equipped Sub-drivers addresses the potential of a flooded induction line -- regardless of cause. The SAS, as compared to the gas or Snort ballast sub-systems, is indeed more complicated. But that added complexity is, I think, offset by the SAS sub-systems ease of use and ability to blow out ballast water from depth or at the surface. The SAS ballast sub-system is a simple and reliable means of managing ballast water without the need of gas and gases attendant trim and logistic problems.

One more thing: I want to take this opportunity to remind everyone that the SAS ballast sub-system I came up with is very much a copy of the fine work done by Manfred Reusing -- he's the guy who lead the way. I simply followed.

And it's no accident that Manfred's system is very much predicated on what actual combat submarines use to manage their main ballast tank water. The SAS very much emulates the design and function of 'real' submarine ballast systems.

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M

Myron and others I too have to jump in here.

David will tell you, that his number one PITA client - ME - has required a long time convincing on the merits of SAS over gas backup. Trawl the search functions on this site for the rantings in this regard. :pop Entertaining stuff.

I have just order 2 new SAS SD's with NO GAS backup. AND SAS fittings to retro fit another SD. I admit its going to be fun wrangling the snorkel valve mechanism inside a 1/72 Permit sail - but will see.

Everything I have purchased from David - works as intended. Guys, I'm pretty much as cautious as they come, but the SAS system I believe is state of the Art and a big leap forward - taking a great design from Manfred and making a prefabricated system available to many. Besides if it doesn't work I'll have David's legs broken.

BTW -where's my order you bum?

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Myron's point about too many holes in the SAS system is valid, and a source of concern for the operator of a model submarine employing this type ballast sub-system. However, the inclusion of the safety float-valve in the plumbing of the Caswell-Merriman SAS equipped Sub-drivers addresses the potential of a flooded induction line -- regardless of cause. The SAS, as compared to the gas or Snort ballast sub-systems, is indeed more complicated. But that added complexity is, I think, offset by the SAS sub-systems ease of use and ability to blow out ballast water from depth or at the surface. The SAS ballast sub-system is a simple and reliable means of managing ballast water without the need of gas and gases attendant trim and logistic problems.

One more thing: I want to take this opportunity to remind everyone that the SAS ballast sub-system I came up with is very much a copy of the fine work done by Manfred Reusing -- he's the guy who lead the way. I simply followed.

And it's no accident that Manfred's system is very much predicated on what actual combat submarines use to manage their main ballast tank water. The SAS very much emulates the design and function of 'real' submarine ballast systems.



M

[vital.spark]

Alec, no offense taken. I just like pulling Davids Leg! As I posted before, I like to follow the KISS princaple. David did a great job on perfection the SAS system but for me any extra holes in a boat can be a future source of problems. I've done a lot of offshore sailing including Hong Kong to San Francisco back in 1973. I can tell you from first hand experiance that a stuck check valve in the middle of the Pacific is no fun with water lapping over your feet!

Regards to all

Myron

[alad61]

I am sorry if I offended you as that wasn't my intent.

For the record I have two boats with gas, one dynamic, one with a pressure tank & slow release pinch valve and the SAS. I have had a gas one go down to the mud, threw the emergency gas switch but no sub to be seen. However it was found though and to this day I'll swear in court that there was gas in the emergency tank but when retrieved the tank was dry? I have also had successful ballast blows with the gas.

However with my ballast & trim issues the other day my Skipjack went down to the bottom, fortunately very near the dock but still about five feet deep. I threw the pump switch and up she poped :wink:

All I am saying is that for me I will be going with the SAS system where ever possible for future subs.

[vital.spark]

I have 3 subs with the gas system and they work!! Sooner or later you are going to wish you had it!!

[alad61]

Mmm gas... It's an added cost through purchase and waste If not all used. Then you need to remember how many times you may have blown the ballast. Also what if the transfer from the can to tank on the SD. There will be that one time your lpb breather is below the surface and there isn't Enough gas to blow the ballast, then what?? Nope no more gas for me.

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Nope. With the exception of the KILO SD and the 1.25 SD's all are SAS as provided, with the option of a gas retro-fit.

M

[vital.spark]

David, How about the Gas System with SAS as an option!

[alad61]

Myron please don't get me wrong about the sas system. It absolutely works!! Any early issues I have had have pretty much been me. If you go long & deep then maybe the gas backup installed as well is good peace of mind but otherwise the SAS does what David intended it to do.

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Myron,

As long as the boat does not pitch or roll excessively, things are fine. If the induction line between snorkel and SD parts, the safety float-valve will keep the water out.

Other than the 2" Kilo SD and 1.25" SD's we gone entirely to SAS, with gas as a retro-fit option.

M

[vital.spark]

David, Yes and what is the result of a collision with a a target or other sub? Thank you but I'll stick with your gas system and LPB.

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

A reminder: Inverting the SD in-water will unseat both the snorkel and safety float-valves, letting water into the SD. However, any angle less than 45-degrees (pitch and/or roll) will find the valves firmly shut.

M

[alad61]

Re Triple S, I'm indeed a member and although Boondal is a 20 min drive from home. The water there is pretty much a giant billabong with not much circulation. It can get pretty murky and still So much so that were you to stick your arm in up to the armpit you'd be hard pressed to see your fingers. To be really honest you could drop a ton of gold bars in there and I still wouldn't dive in after them with the water there. On top of that they have been struggling for years with the weed. When I put a sub in there it's down to periscope depth only and if I do go deep to avoid a surface runner it's havoc on the nerves... LOL.

Regarding the SAS & snorkle. The first couple of trials both in the tub & in open water produced some water in the SD but I have tweaked it and now not so much. I reckon that any water it takes in now is that from water hanging around the top of the float valve as it is a strong pump. Jim suggested using those little silica satchels you get in a vitamin bottle to absorb it and reduce the risk of it sloshing around. I also think that when the sub runs level without the porpoising then that'll help keep the float firmly against the valve which will reduce any water being "pumped" into the induction tube as the float moves up & down with the motion of the sub.

[Slats]

Thanks for the compliment I did mute the front sonar covers as the colours specified look to bright & clean for me. I don't know if the escape bouyies would be the international orange when on active patrol but I kept them as visual reference.

Yes even for Brisbane the days & water are getting cooler than previous years. Most of the local pools are closed here as well as I have been told by the shore council that rc vehicles aren't all that welcome in our council run pools. Yet they do little in maintaining any community lakes in the shores park lands!

Alec
are you a Triple S member?

Re the International Orange - IMHO good to have that on the model for visual reference.

Also how do you find the snorkel valve operation for the SAS? Any teething problems?



J