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Echo II plans I got from Boris. Dave I had to cobble those together because Boris sent plans that way. OK so let's hear it for the funny looking Echo II. Red headed step child.
Yes it is wider in the middle. I have the hull cross sections and it shows wider in the middle. Very good Happrich. I will make you a Echo II admirer soon.
Out of interest, having you two old subdrivers on the wire: how effective do you think the ECHO' s would have really been against against their opponents-by-design, U.S. carrier groups? I read a russian statement giving you the impression the soviet combat strategy would have used the echo's and juliett's as some sort of disposeable one-way weapon, a calculated loss.
Only one word for the Echo and Juliett sailors. Suicide.I was a sonarman and we had the Sosus stations track those boys the minute they left port. Question is did the US have enough fast boats to shadow those guys and blow them out of the water before they could launch. Answer is probably yes. Guarantee you anywhere the carriers go you can bet they would be out say 200-300 miles to where the effective range of those missiles. But just let one of those missiles launch then the carrier force would be toast.
Ok.. could one say the Charlie's meant an improvement?from what i know they were loud as well. Could the carriergroup not simply outrun the 1st and 2nd generation soviet ssgn's?
Out of interest, having you two old subdrivers on the wire: how effective do you think the ECHO' s would have really been against against their opponents-by-design, U.S. carrier groups? I read a russian statement giving you the impression the soviet combat strategy would have used the echo's and juliett's as some sort of disposeable one-way weapon, a calculated loss.
My first boat was the TRUTTA. We operated out of Key West, but most of our underway time was working our ASW forces around Cuba -- most of the time we played the 'bad guy', and in most of those training scenarios we were an ECHO. We had no real problem getting through the destroyer screen, but sometimes got nailed by units of the air ASW force (one MK44 exercise torpedo bounced off our turtleback -- I was in the after room at the time, that was a real attention-getter). We often got significant kills in these exercises, and most of the time we got out of there without detection, and if detected we evaded with little difficulty.
The deal is this: the Soviets had a real hard-on for our battle-groups and spent a lot of R&D, and other resources working up effective ways at taking out our carriers. The Russian's still do. ALFA, CHARLIE, NOVEMBER, JULLIET were all systems designed from the get-go to engage our capital ships, either by speeding in to bust the screen or to stand off and lob missiles at the heart of the battle-group.
The Russian's are like us: they won't throw people away like the Japanese used to -- we, and the Russians, cherish our alabaster butts too much for that kind of heroic horse-****. However, like us here in America, the Russians will spare no expense to find a way to tear the heart out of an opponent. Both peoples love our toys and enjoy engaging in Man's Greatest Outdoor Activity. So far it's only been 'war-games'. Thank God.
Today, the real threat to American supremacy on the seas is the OSCAR class. Those boats scare me to death, more so than their Boomers. and the Chinese are getting froggy -- things might get interesting in and around their territorial waters.
Thank both of you a lot for that first-hand insight.you dont read that in the books. I mean, the tech details are one thing. Practical experience is something else. Never thought a fleetboat could threaten a 1970's (right, david?) ASW force.
Best regards,Jörg
I got Boris's Oscar plans. 1/72 is going to be like 84" but again his plans are awesome. Mom says go for it. Remember 1 nuclear weapon will ruin your whole day. Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades and nuclear weapons.
Thank both of you a lot for that first-hand insight.you dont read that in the books. I mean, the tech details are one thing. Practical experience is something else. Never thought a fleetboat could threaten a 1970's (right, david?) ASW force.
Best regards,Jörg
Yup. 1970 till we gave the boat to the Turk's. Yuck! They eventually turned the old girl into a battery barge and turned the sail into a monument. I would rather we turned the thing into razor-blades!
I, for one, am following with great interest. I love the Foxtrot. That triple prop thing is just too cool for words. Very much looking forward to updates from two very talented builders.
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