Fillers and Adhesive's

[rwtdiver]

I have a question as to what kind of filler I would use! I am using button type magnets to secure the deck on my ARKMODE Type VII submarine.



The magnets are recessed into the deck approximately 1/16"! What type of filler would one use that would adhere to the magnet but also the plastic? My first thought was to use baking soda and thin CA, and make sure not to put it on to heavy because that mixture turns to almost cement consistence when cured making finishing a little tough!

Any thoughts as to what might work? Thank you...

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Yes, the CA and baking soda to build up a leveling foundation. Finish off with Nitro-Stan touch-up putty.

[rwtdiver]

Yes, the CA and baking soda to build up a leveling foundation. Finish off with Nitro-Stan touch-up putty.

YEP! Baking Soda and thin CA! David you taught me that trick some time back and I really like it. Not only will it fill in the gap, but it will add strength to the already glued joint.

David! Is this the Nitro-Stan you are referring to: https://www.amazon.com/Glazing-Autom.../dp/B08HZ82GXF

Thanks again David for your help!!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

YEP! Baking Soda and thin CA! David you taught me that trick some time back and I really like it. Not only will it fill in the gap, but it will add strength to the already glued joint.

David! Is this the Nitro-Stan you are referring to: https://www.amazon.com/Glazing-Autom.../dp/B08HZ82GXF

Thanks again David for your help!!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

Yup...................

[redboat219]

This any good for RC sub use?

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

This any good for RC sub use?

Crap!

Any consumable marketed in a hobby shop is formulated to be safe... not useful! Today's hobby shop is only good for RTR Chinese crap, magazines, and bad advice issued by a clerk who thinks model building is plugging in a 3D printer and mashing the 'enter' key!

If the consumable does not promote Cancer, hair-loss, and/or impotency, it's likely a bland, no-stick, never-dry useless gooey pap.

Buy your stuff from professional car refinishing product outlets, not 'hobby shops'. The good stuff is usually not on the store shelves -- you have to ask for it; it's availability acknowledged by the grizzled old, cranky, tobacco juice dribbling clerk who first looks to his left, then the right, then holding eye contact with you, leaning in up close to render a conspiratorial wink, followed by his reach under the counter to give you the, 'real thing'. Now, we're talk'n! That's the stuff you want.

Daivd

[rwtdiver]

I have all the button magnets installed.



Using this same photo. As you can see the magnets are counter sunk approximately 1/16" into the top of the deck. With the metallic finish of the magnet would it be advisable to scratch or sand the finish to give the Nitro-Stan a better chance of adhering to the magnet itself? Just as a side note: The magnets are 5mm in dia. and the hole was also drilled out with a 5mm drill bit. The magnets were a good snug fit, and I used thin CA to secure them into the hole, which seems to be holding very well.

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

I have all the button magnets installed.



Using this same photo. As you can see the magnets are counter sunk approximately 1/16" into the top of the deck. With the metallic finish of the magnet would it be advisable to scratch or sand the finish to give the Nitro-Stan a better chance of adhering to the magnet itself? Just as a side note: The magnets are 5mm in dia. and the hole was also drilled out with a 5mm drill bit. The magnets were a good snug fit, and I used thin CA to secure them into the hole, which seems to be holding very well.

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

I assume the magnets in the hull make direct contact with the magnets in the deck?

Remember the strength of the magnetic field is subject to the invers-square law: the force is reduced by a factor of four with each doubling of the distance between them; you want those magnets to touch to realize their full holding power.

1/16" is too deep for an air-dry putty -- it will never fully harden. Use a Bondo like automotive filler.

DO NOT abrade away the very thin Chromium plating of the magnet -- underneath is a very unstable metal that oxidizes just by looking at it! Degrease the magnets surface with lacquer thinner and that's it.



David

[rwtdiver]

I assume the magnets in the hull make direct contact with the magnets in the deck?

Remember the strength of the magnetic field is subject to the invers-square law: the force is reduced by a factor of four with each doubling of the distance between them; you want those magnets to touch to realize their full holding power.

1/16" is too deep for an air-dry putty -- it will never fully harden. Use a Bondo like automotive filler.

DO NOT abrade away the very thin Chromium plating of the magnet -- underneath is a very unstable metal that oxidizes just by looking at it! Degrease the magnets surface with lacquer thinner and that's it.



David

David,

Thank you again for all the great information and photos! I have all the magnets installed, and they are at 1/16" deep into the hull. All the magnets seem to be making a very good surface to surface matting and they are holding well.

So at this point I will clean the top deck surface magnets with lacquer thinner and then apply a coat of the Nano-Stan filler that I have coming! Final light sanding at those points and call it good!?

Side Note: Bob Martin has a YouTube out on how he did the weathering and final finish to his boat, I am going to try (NOT TRY! DO) what he did to my Type VII as well!!

Thanks again David!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

I didn't make myself clear in my previous post: DO NOT use the Nitro-Stan air-dry putty to fill a deep (1/16") hole. Instead use an isothermal curing filler, like Bondo.

David

[rwtdiver]

I keep forgetting that you are a perfectionist when it comes to this type of detail work! I should have been a little more precise at the depth of the hole. It is much closer to 1/32" than 1/16" deep, and some even less than 1/32"!



So what you are saying this Bondo spot putty would be a better fit than the Nitro-Stan? Sorry for the misinformation on my part David! Well now that I have a $35.00 tube of the Nitro-Stan coming may I ask you what it might be good for! I see in your "Today's Work" blog that you are using the Nitro Stan all the time, and from what I see you seem to be using it as a filler.

David! Could you (WHEN YOU HAVE THE TIME) expand on what the difference is between the Bondo putty and the Nitro-Stan?

Thanks David!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

[Das Boot]

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

I keep forgetting that you are a perfectionist when it comes to this type of detail work! I should have been a little more precise at the depth of the hole. It is much closer to 1/32" than 1/16" deep, and some even less than 1/32"!



So what you are saying this Bondo spot putty would be a better fit than the Nitro-Stan? Sorry for the misinformation on my part David! Well now that I have a $35.00 tube of the Nitro-Stan coming may I ask you what it might be good for! I see in your "Today's Work" blog that you are using the Nitro Stan all the time, and from what I see you seem to be using it as a filler.

David! Could you (WHEN YOU HAVE THE TIME) expand on what the difference is between the Bondo putty and the Nitro-Stan?

Thanks David!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"

There are two types of materials that fill gaps, seams, holes, and even build up into a recontouring a substrate.



The air-dry 'putties', like Nitro-Stan are suitable only for very shallow scratches, engravings, and tight fillets. The air-dry putties, if built up too thick, never completely harden as the agent of state change (from liquid/goo to solid) is the liberation of the solvent(s) that suspend the inert solids and binders of the putty. Applied too thick the putties surface (in contact with air) will only skin over as a solid, but the underlying putty will not make the state change any time soon -- and when it does it will happen well after the model has been completed. As the putty shrinks as it dries it will ruin the finish of the model. 1/32" is as deep a fill I would use an air-dry putty for. Give it 12-hours to harden before filing and sanding it flush to the deck.

Air-dry putties can be applied with finger, syringe, brush, putty-knife (duh!), and screeding blade. Such putties -- providing they are applied in very thin thickness -- can, in addition to filling imperfections on the models surface, represent raised weld beads, raised panels, clinker joins, rivets, and staggered plating.











In the picture you referenced I used the air-dry Nitro-Stan (the best putty of this type on the whole ****ing planet!) to fill very shallow scratch marks left by file and course sandpaper. Deep fill on the area around the control horn was accomplished with CA-baking soda, which was also the agent of adhesion between the metal horn and resin control surface.

The two-part fillers harden through a chemical reaction between the filler and a catalyst. Ironically, the thicker you put this filler down, the quicker it cures as the agent of state change is the heat generated when the ingredients of the filler and catalyst come together. Bondo, Milliput, and Evercoat are but three of the brand names of your typical two-part fillers. After laying that stuff down you can, in some cases, work it with file and sandpaper in minutes. These fillers are used for deep fill jobs and to build up surfaces for recontouring; the material itself becomes the substrate in the areas applied. You see in the pictures how it can be screeded on to make new shapes. The thicker you make it, the quicker it cures, so one has to work large areas with several small applications at a time.

Two-part fillers are ideal for deep filling, recontouring, fillets, and screed forming. Milliput lends itself to sculpting jobs as well.















David

[rwtdiver]

David,

Thank you for taking the time to explain the differences in the types of fillers that one could use for different processes! Your explanation and photos are a great help to me in understanding the finishing processes that are used in our hobby. And with all the different hull materials that are available and used for hull building, it's no wonder we have such a variety of fillers, primers, and finishes and each one is specific to the different materials we use in out building.

Thank you again David, I do appreciate you taking the time to give (me) all of us this valuable information that we can put to use!

Rob
"Firemen can stand the heat"