revell VIIc

[satlite440]

hi david.. this is shane....1st let me say i greatly respect your skills and work.. and most importantly i know you are a busy guy with a life... and other obligations and more pressing concerns than sorting out the f.n.g's issues.also i know from the thread reveiws this is a hobbie that lots start and few finish and haveing worked in a dealership shop in the heavyline side(engine/transmission) i know all about the lazy,stupid,come figure it out for me so i can flag it attitude ,so i am hesitant to bother you like this... but i assure you i will finish.. although i am on a budget and will be moveing in stages(after this timming belt job i will be over 3/4 way to the subdriver.. then comes transmiter ect,etc..)but i want it to turn out right,and plan for future additions like working tubes into my build and not have to work around issues later and since your the best i know of and have done this before and did the mods already i direct my questions to you. my plans so far now this weekend is to make a mould from clay and plaster of paris for the keel weights and do some research on melting tire weights somehow with out getting into trouble with the wife hahah havent figured out a diagnostic stratagy for moulding closed cell foam for the saddle tanks gotta do more research.. but that and the flooding holes question are my main hang ups now.. there are others but they can wait for now.gotta get over these problems 1st...once again i am greatful for the time you take to respond to newbies like me breathing your air.. many thanks.

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

I'm sorry I did not get back to you when I said I would. Let's try to sort this out.

Yes, you've punched out enough flood-drain holes. The only holes you need in the deck are those six or eight round holes where the retractable bollards are. open those up and you will adiquatly vent the deck.

Don't make the lead weight fixed ballast any more complicated than you have to. Cut and hammer to shape enough lead to fit about 2/3 of the available space within the long longitudinal cavity formed by the submarines 'keel' at the bottom of the hull. It's not necessary to make it conformal or pretty. And tac-glue tje lead it in with a little RTV as during the trimming phase you're going to add/remove lead and move it fore and aft.

Again, don't make a big deal out the foam you're going to fill the 'bulges' in the sides of the hull. Some hunks of foam, worked with sandpaper and knife will do the job.

[satlite440]

well after a long busy day in 90degree heat, was volunteered to help get a load of lumber for the neighbor it was 2 for a arbor..load up the car dolly and fetch a friends car, drag it home, got to the shop for some tools diag it ,pronounce time of death for a 96 dodge neon(broken timming belt on an interferance moter) cook hamburgers on the grill for the tribe. i got to make my positive and my negitives for my keel weighs yea! but as luck would have it forgot the portable oxy/actealine torch and tire weights on my bench next to my tool box agaggahahag F.M.L. so will have to wait till tomarrow but in between i picked up the mould matreial and a pot from the goodwill .. funny the wife has no problem useing a pot or pan in her crafting and we got to buy a new one.. but i want one to melt some lead and it's a capital offence???????????? was cheaper to get one and made for a more peaceful day.. evan got to take the target ship out at 8pm with a pt of mactarnahanns to go with permission of the comander and cheif..yes! sot back late got the positive out of the mould.. (warning regardless of what the crafty wife says nomater how many projects she has done from jo anns do not use saran wrap as a mould release from art plaster.. should have used trans oil)but overall i think it turned out well. we will see how the weighs come out monday will try to make a few of varying amounts going up from the aprox 8 oz i read in a thread.thats why the positive and negitves are so deep. as i want to compensate for at least 3 tubes all 5 would be cool but probably over the top, hard enought to convince the cic i need all 5 when all she bugeted for was 3... we will see.. and didn't get to covington's hobbie shop for brass to try to make a wintersgarden rail as mine was broke in shipping along with the keelgard/rudder brace so when i get them done try not to laugh to hard ok? i will at least warn you so you won't spit coffee or other beverages on your moniter deal?

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

So, you're going ahead with the cast-your-own-keel-weight deal. Hey ... you're making it happen. There's no arguing with success.

I too have to run some covert stuff past the Little Lady sometimes. Funny, but Ellie and I have the same issues you just described with your Lady over lead melting. Small world.

Make sure that plaster is completely cured before pouring -- and make sure you got some eye-protection on when you make the pour. Good work so far.

Time for some solder work to replace those broken kit parts.

Keep at it.

David

[satlite440]

it will have been 48 hr for mould cure by mon.. alwys wear my snap-on glasses when doing flame or undercar looking straight up(a coworker learned thid lesson the hard way on friday, after snickering at the the old dog last month..i have the only lift big enought for limos so he had to change a cat converter on the ground after smokewrenching the nuts off a 6.0L h2 hummer limo,thank god he had to pull the torch hose out and run an air line out or he would be blind in on eye now.a hot nut droped right on to his left eye and was still hot enough to leave a surface burn on the eyelid.we will see if he looks like quasimoto on monday) now to see if the covington r/c shop is open today....

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Ouch! That reminds me to be a bit more careful in the shop.

David

[satlite440]

foam and scrach built rudder support

so after sunday chores were done made it up to the hobbie shop.got some depron foam discused in a previous thread.. rough fit it.while talking to the guy there,he said you could mould/shap it with a heat gun(note to self DO NOT get caught with the wife hairdryer or her embossing powder gun without asking again) so i had to give it a shot.. think it was to much heat so i have a question if the depron gets too hot and shrinks a little does it loose its abilty to produce floatation in water? this is a trial run got a whole sheet to practice with,, also going to try the bread&butter style and give a shot at shapeing it... so if you skipped the the pic's 1st i am not responsable for any liquids sprayed on your moniter.if you havent looked swallow now before looking.. so the rudder/skeg support was broke during shipping so this is my 1st attempt in silver sodering in 2 yrs or so,it's not great but it did roadtest the concept going to try brass tube and music wire toether after i pick up another stand as 2 aligater clip will not be enough to hold the wintergarden together as i solder around it..hopefully will have pics of casted weights tomarrow if i have a few extra minets on the gmc envoy moter replacement.but its monday so it will be a mad house at the shop......shane

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Shane,

First, nice job on the silve-solder rudder-skeg support structure. Me? I would have soft-soldered the thing, but ... what the hey.

You're putting so much effort into that spongy foam when you would be much better served just to carve out what you need from the closed-cell foam from the hardware store (the pink or blue stuff, not the white).

Looking forward to your weight casting adventure tomorrow.

David

[satlite440]

i can use that?..... might have some in the garage..i thought i read you said the depron foam for airplanes...??? might try that as well...by the way what is soft-soldering.. is that like wicking solder to brass pipe in plumbing?..not familer with the term.. i had to do siver soder for stuff on other projects includeing the target boat mast tops..its never as pretty as i would like it but i keep at it and it's a little better every time.. and a comlement from you is awsome... i was afraid to show it. i think the mast tops turned out better.. need a smaller tip for the iorn or just need to get a good one...that ones a rough fit based of the broken one on the sprue. would like to find a way to reduce the eye holes in the end to the rudder pin.gotta put some thought in to that next.. thank david

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

You did that work with a 'hard' silver solder. My hat's off to you.

All soldering and brazing is a means of adhering one metal to another through introduction of a plating metal of low melt temperature (lower than the melting temperature of the metal parts being joined). The higher the melt temperature of the soldering metal or alloy, the closer the possible interaction between the atoms of the associated metals (the solder and the metal of the parts being joined).

And for those looking over our shoulder: Soldering is not welding -- there is no fusion between the metal parts, only adherence as a consequence of atomic binding forces between adjoining atoms. Soldering is adhesion, not cohesion. There is no chemical change involved in soldering (disregarding the chemical changes to the surface of the participating metals induced by a cleaning flux or rosin).

All that to say that silver-soldering employs a solder of considerable temperature -- more difficult to do than soldering employing lower temp. solders such as the classic Lead-Tin, and Tin-Antimony. Well done, Shane.

I never advocated use of Depron foam in a model submarine -- you likely got that from someone else.

You still need to punch holes in your metal part to accept the bearing pins of the rudders and stern planes? A .032" drill bit will do the trick.

David

[satlite440]

so should i not use it? i didn't have the kind i thought i did. and if you advise against it i will get the other pink or blue from home depot this week. i did play with it and found i like the bread&butter and shape it down with a dremel and sanding drum(not to self don't do this when you just got out of the shower haha wife mumbling something about stupid men and wasteing water or something like that..) and will do it with the pink stuff .as i said i want to make this boat right the 1st time and am willing to take the time and effort to do so.. (wife complains about how i over engineer things i build and projects around the house but admits we never have to do it 2 times,dryfits go on forever though. and she don't mind cuz half of her scrappbooking room and storage trays i made or fabbed up like her ink carrasel that holds 300 2x4 inch ink pads in a 1&1/2 foot area but is 3 ft tall. i have to move it though she can't lift it..) so say the word and the pink stuff it will be..got some valuable practice today though.. the depron can be heat moulded but i wasn't happy with the fit or look(it's the one that looks all withered.. the bread&butter shaped and fit better but was messy, was chased outside,dont know why we have hardwood floors and kids to sweep hahaha. as to the rudder-skeg i put the smallest eyelets i have in them(waiting till tomarrow to begg to look in the wifes scrapbooking embelishment stuff as i think i remember she had a smaller metal eye for something or other. also gotta go to the other hobby shop and look cuz they do alot of rigged ship models and might have something smaller. i guess barring that i will try flattening the brass tube and drilling a hole in it to see if it fits better.. thanks shane

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

Get the pink stuff.

I see what you mean when you say eyelet, now. Fill the eye with CA, hit it with zip-kicker, then drill a .032" hole through the CA. Done.

David

[redboat219]

When I eventually start my own Type 7 conversion, I too want to replace the kit rudder support skegs with beefier brass rods. But I plan to flatten the ends so I'll have something to drill out.

About the keel weight, instead of smelting lead why not do what scale aircraft model builders do to keep their models level on their landing gears-lead shots held in place with epoxy or CA. Much easier and safer.

[vital.spark]

Lead shot in epoxy was the way Caswell supplied the balast weight for both the Type VII and the Gato that I did just over a year ago. The Type VII was in 3 sections and the Gato in 6. I must also add that not all the supplied weight was used in either model.

In the past I replied about the foam for the type VII, saying that by using a rough file or Stanley Surform hand plan to get the rough shape in the pink foam, than finish off with sandpaper, the job was done in less than 1 hour! As David would probably say, " no need to make a mountian out of a mole hill."

[He Who Shall Not Be Named]

When I eventually start my own Type 7 conversion, I too want to replace the kit rudder support skegs with beefier brass rods. But I plan to flatten the ends so I'll have something to drill out.

About the keel weight, instead of smelting lead why not do what scale aircraft model builders do to keep their models level on their landing gears-lead shots held in place with epoxy or CA. Much easier and safer.

No need to replace the skeg mounted rudder piece if the kit supplied plastic part is OK. I've had the kit parts (including the plastic stern plane and bow plane pieces) on my operational Type-7 and have been operating that model for nearly four years now without breakage. Don't find boogie-men where they are not.

Sure, bird-shot and epoxy is a fine way to go.

Finish your KILO first!

David